Sharing violation problem with autosave?

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  • #1460
    David Morris
    Participant

    I’ve been having this problem now for quite some time, and it appears to be very intermittent and non-reproduceable. I’m currently running 9.10.04 but it has happened with prior 9.10 versions. I don’t recall ever seeing this before 9.10.

    I’ll be editing code and at some interval (I expect the auto-save interval) I’ll get an error message box complaining of an access violation with some file I’m editing.

    Here’s a screenshot:

    Clicking Retry just repeats the error ad-nauseum, and Cancel results in another message box reporting a sharing violation with said file. I can still manually save the file and go about my business, but this problem is annoying as it happens quite frequently during some editing sessions, and obviously it breaks the auto-save feature.

    Problem is, the file isn’t being accessed by anything else that I know of. The files are on my local harddrive, and this happens when MEW is the only user process running. I’m wondering if perhaps it could be my AV software (AVG) trying to keep tabs on the file in question, or some other background process that scans the filesystem, but if so I would expect others to be seeing the same problem.

    Could MEW be a bit too strict in it’s access policy?

    Has anyone else noticed this?


    David

    #5235
    Clay Martin
    Keymaster
    #5246
    Michal Vodicka
    Participant

    This is an old and still unresolved problem. I also had it few years ago at w9x but only indeterminently and wasn’t able to find the reason. Never saw it at NT/w2k/XP and I don’t need to use w9x anymore, hopefully.

    From what I saw it is probably caused by MEW itself; some internal conflict which probably depends on timing. However, I might miss something, IIRC I had the only chance to capture file operations in this state.

    To exclude problem with AVG, which can cause it both directly and indirectly (timing change), you can disable on-line scanning for C and H files which is useless, anyway. I don’t know how exactly to do it but any reasonable antivirus allows it.

    I would be useful if you always state which OS version including SPs you’re using when report such a problem.

    #5249
    David Morris
    Participant

    I would be useful if you always state which OS version including SPs you’re using when report such a problem.[/quote:3v8kfgtl]
    I thought at least the OS would be obvious from the screenshot. :oops:

    I’m running XP Pro SP2, but this occurred prior to SP2 (and probably prior to SP1).

    FWIW Michael I’ve been running MEW ever since the first version (and ME-DOS for many years before that) and I’ve never seen this behavior on either 9x or NT OS’s until this started after v9.10. Maybe it’s the same problem you saw years ago, but it’s the first I’ve seen it in all of my years in working with MEW (btw I’m the Telnet developer).

    I’ll check on configuring AVG to ignore C/H files, but I’m thinking it only scans binary or script extensions capable of execution.

    #5250
    Clay Martin
    Keymaster

    Oooops! :oops:

    Win98 se with latest updates.

    Yea, I’m not much for the bleeding edge, heck I’m still running ME9.10.3! I guess that I am afraid of change. :wink:

    Guess my boss is afraid of change too, as I’m using a system from 2000. Maybe just cheep. :lol:

    Clay

    #5251
    Michal Vodicka
    Participant

    I thought at least the OS would be obvious from the screenshot. :oops:[/quote:2zd88697]

    Ah, you’re rigth. I haven’t noticed it because use classic view at XP and w2k3, this new look is too ugly ;-)

    FWIW Michael I’ve been running MEW ever since the first version (and ME-DOS for many years before that) and I’ve never seen this behavior on either 9x or NT OS’s until this started after v9.10. Maybe it’s the same problem you saw years ago, but it’s the first I’ve seen it in all of my years in working with MEW (btw I’m the Telnet developer).[/quote:2zd88697]

    My theory is the problem depends on timing which depends on OS, computer speed and also changes with MEW version. That’s why you might not notice it before although it is probably there for years. I’m almost sure I saw it with MEW 8.0 and also 9.0.

    Well, there is something to examine. Download System Internal’s FileMon [url:2zd88697]http://www.sysinternals.com/ntw2k/source/filemon.shtml[/url:2zd88697] and Process Explorer [url:2zd88697]http://www.sysinternals.com/ntw2k/freeware/procexp.shtml[/url:2zd88697]. Install the, start FileMon and try to reproduce problem. It’d be useful to set filter to affected file(s). Don’t filter process, because there can be something else which accesses this file. Once reproduced, try to Retry several times and then save log. Before cancelling error, start Process Explorer and try to find all processes who have opened this file. If you don’t find anything useful, send me saved FileMon log.

    I’ll check on configuring AVG to ignore C/H files, but I’m thinking it only scans binary or script extensions capable of execution.[/quote:2zd88697]

    It seems reasonable but I saw AVs which scanned everything by default (and caused problems for our sw). Better to check.

    #5253
    Michal Vodicka
    Participant

    Clay,

    try also the FileMon and Process Explorer. Your problem can be different and these tools can give useful info.

    #5254
    David Morris
    Participant

    I already have both of those tools, Michael, it just didn’t dawn on me to use them for this. I’ll give them a try and report back with the results.

    #5255
    Michal Vodicka
    Participant

    David,

    check if you have the latest version of Process Explorer, it is updated quite often and there is a lot of improvements in new versions.

    #5256
    Clay Martin
    Keymaster

    Michal,
    Did as you requested. Durring the error processmon indicated that mew32.exe was the only process with a handle on the file. Attached is excerpt from filemon. As it turned out I fired up ME made change to file and then went to ftp it. Error happened on the first try :D So I cliped out filemon log from start of ME to after I had canceled the error and the ftp occured. At least I think I got that all.

    There’s a whooole lot of file handle-ing go-in on out there!

    :shock:

    HTH,
    Clay

    p.s. file name being ftp’ed main.css
    errlog.txt

    #5257
    Michal Vodicka
    Participant

    Clay,

    I’m sorry but I don’t see any error logged. Which file name was displayed in error dialog?

    It seems you have installed something from Symantec. NAV? If so, try to disable it, it is probably the most problematic AV ever and can cause both this error and the fact it wasn’t logged. I mean, disable on-line scanning and see if the error occurs again. If not, disable scanning of affected file extensions.

    #5258
    Clay Martin
    Keymaster

    p.s. file name being ftp’ed main.css[/quote:2a01zs79]

    Must be a timing thing, I thought that I edited my post within seconds of posting it.

    I’ll see if I can reproduce without NAV/NIS

    #5259
    Michal Vodicka
    Participant

    I’m almost sure it wasn’t there when I read it the first time :)

    The only access to main.css is on the log beginning and successful. Then there is FTP transfer. Maybe you clipped log too late, after the error.

    #5260
    Clay Martin
    Keymaster

    Michal,

    After telling NAV and NIS to stop autocheck and reproduced problem. In attached file around line 138 seems to be the start of the error before the ftp operation.

    Clay
    errlog.txt

    #5261
    Michal Vodicka
    Participant

    Interesting. MEW opens main.css at line 138, reads 3973 bytes and leaves it opened. Later it tries to move it to recycle bin (line 237) which is unsuccessful so it tries to delete it (line 243) with no success again. It makes sense because opened file can be neither moved or deleted. File is closed at line 940.

    File is probably deleted because MEW creates a new one with newer contents (MEWB301.TMP) and want to delete old and rename temp file to this one.

    Questions: what is main.css file size before and after the error. Is the file changed in between? I’d like to know why MEW tries to delete it. Is is possible the file is partially loaded (File Properties, Text In Memory and the next line) — it is necessary to know the state before error. It is just a guess: I’d thinking about the reason why MEW doesn’t close file and partial load could be the reason.

    I’m affaid there is some MEW bug and it is probably the same which causes David’s error; I vagually remember the scenario I saw was similar. I’ll try to find what can cause it when have time which can take several weeks.

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